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> Are You On The Road To...Audio Hell?
clint e.
Posted: February 01, 2008 03:25 pm
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D161t@L 0N L1N3 / Analog at heart
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From Enjoy The Music.com, an interesting article :

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/view...1/audiohell.htm


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user posted image "It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition.
My discovery was the result of musical perception." (When asked about his theory of relativity) - Albert Einstein user posted image
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dingus
Posted: February 01, 2008 03:34 pm
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How can people be so cruel?
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very interesting .... i'll have to ponder this idea.


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Teledyne AR9, Yamaha B-2x, Yamaha M-2, Yamaha C-2a, EAD DSP 1000, Squeezebox v3, Wadia WT-3200.
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Elroy
Posted: February 01, 2008 05:17 pm
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I'm afflicted, is it curable it?

This post has been edited by Elroy on February 01, 2008 05:18 pm


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I got nothing

Yamaha CX-2000
Yamaha MX-2000
Yamaha CDX-2020 CDP
Zhaolu 3.0 DAC Modded
Vandersteen 2c
Denon DP62L
Teac X-2000 R2R
Nakamichi BX-125
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Pure_Brew
Posted: July 01, 2010 10:51 pm
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What a great read.

According to this I'm living in Audio Hell. And from what I know about myself and my system, I do indeed live there.

Personally I find most audio systems, speaking most specifically about speakers, are either fatiguing, bass challenged (too much or too little), too difficult to place and the price/performance ratio to be too steep.

I've sold components for years and owned a pretty decent amount of components and speakers over a 15yr period. While I have come to the conclusion that I may never be satisfied with a singular system within my budget, I haven't completely given up either.

I've even considered building my own speakers, and have spent a great deal of time on that subject. That of course is quite a challenge unto itself, and the quest for making something that suits me in the realm of affordability, is pretty much impossible, since the upfront costs in design and construction are extremely high.

That being said, there is no one that could pull me out of that Hell but me. Have I listened to systems that I find satisfactory? Yes but always way too expensive. The more budget minded components I have found can be very good in performance, but will tend to have that "careful-of-the-volume" design, lack of bass or both.


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System: Snell JIV & CIV. PS Audio 200c. Denon DAP-2500. Parasound CDP/1000. Parasound DAC/1000. Nikko Gamma 20

Back-Up: Pioneer SX-1280
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DolbySProject
Posted: August 24, 2010 03:18 pm
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4. Do you believe that the true function of an audio system is to re-create music; and that therefore you can only accurately evaluate audio playback if you have an extensive knowledge of live music performance?

7. When you ask yourself; "What should be the correct reference, live music or the recording session?" Do you conclude that it is one or the other? Are you comfortable with you answer to this question?



These questions, in my mind, are very closely related, if not one in the same.

I've always questioned the wisdom of using live music as a reference. As a musician of, ahem, many years, I would definitely not want my system to sound "live". I can only think of two places I've played where the sound on stage was truly excellent. One is a tiny club downtown and the other seated about 3,000. Otherwise, the sound onstage typically ranges from passable, to pathetic, sometimes having to step out in front of the house mains to more accurately hear what was going on, right on the stage I was standing. Even practicing acoustically, with the other musicians right there, if the room isn't treated well the sound can be splashy, awash in reverberations or overly muted. When it's just right, it's magic; but, that's rare. So, for me, when someone says "it's like you're right there with the musicians" that doesn't necessarily get me excited.

As far as being in the audience and having the performance shouted back to me through PA speakers at high decibels in mono is no prize either. It takes a super sound engineer to overcome the failure points of most venues. Once they do, there is still "the cougher" in the next row and "the talkers" a few seats to your right. Outside venues? Then you've got wind, airplanes, traffic, etc. The exception seems to be a symphonic presentation in a great hall, sitting 3 or so rows back. Now that, is impressive and I must say not even the best speakers I've heard, including the big Maggies, could compete with that. In general, I find no speaker compares to sitting directly in front of any instrument, whether it be my acoustic, Marshall stack, French Horn, violin, piano, etc.

Then there's the Hendrix experience; where the studio is used, intentionally, as a tool and the music has it's origin there (Electric Ladyland). "The studio album." For Miles Davis' post bop era the engineers chopped up recordings and spliced them together to create something that didn't actually happen that way. It gets a little crazy. Even if we are familiar with the sound of a trumpet, even every one ever made... Miles' often altered his trumpet with a wah-wah. Now we're presented with having to know which wah-wah he used; an original Vox, Clyde McCoy, Dunlop Crybaby????

I'm satisfied if I can come reasonably close to a presentation that can relay the actual pre-recorded program material I've purchased with the least amount of negative coloration (and each man, must for himself, decide what that is). That presents the final challenge. I have no idea what the original pre-recorded program material sounds like. Catch 22. That's where specs are important to me. If it's a symphony in D major, I want a TT that won't spin it up to E flat major or down to C major. So I don't miss the lowest synth note or the highest piccolo tweet, I need a system that will be as flat as possible across 20Hz to 20kHz. Slight colorations, sonic signature differences, here and there are no biggie. I understand one can enjoy music on an AM radio with a 3 inch speaker; however, it's far more enjoyable, for me, on a system with far higher fidelity. If I never get to the mystical "audio nirvana", s'ok, as long as I don't spend my entire listening session wincing in pain, all the better if I can vanish deep into the music. It's takes a good system to do that; but, it doesn't take the "holy grail".

My two cents... ...just thoughts.


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Main System (stripped down to fit smaller space... "sigh"):
Technics SL-1200MK2 Bottlehead Seduction Pioneer CT-F900
Pioneer CT-F1250 Revox PR99MKI dbx200 dbx224
Marantz VC-6001 Bottlehead Foreplay III SAE Mark IIIA

Occasional substitutions:
Technics SL-M3 Teac X-10R Sony TC-KA1ESa Kenwood KM-106
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dingus
Posted: August 25, 2010 12:11 pm
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How can people be so cruel?
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i've done more than my fair share of chasing my tail, but in the end i've found more value in enjoying the gear i have than lusting after what i dont. we dont have the technology yet where sound can be reproduced with true fidelity, so the endless pursuit for better gear ultimately leads to disappointment. better to put more focus on the music imo.


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Teledyne AR9, Yamaha B-2x, Yamaha M-2, Yamaha C-2a, EAD DSP 1000, Squeezebox v3, Wadia WT-3200.
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MacGyver
Posted: August 28, 2010 09:04 am
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indeed. my system is hardly even anywhere close to "True Hi-Fi" in most Audiophile/Music Lover's eyes,
but every component has been hand picked by me according to my personal
tastes and desires, and the resultant collection as a whole brings me
nothing but pleasure.

in sum, i do not believe i ever did go down a "Road To Audio Hell"
but a road to the Hi-Fi Audio/A/V system of my dreams, and,
though it has taken the lion's share of the first decade of the
21st century to get there, i feel i have finally arrived.

not to bad an accomplishment for a man of a mere 28 years of age, i think...


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PIONEER VSX-D1S TOTL 130w/ch. A/V Stereo Receiver (1990/1993)
PIONEER PD-91 Reference Compact Disc Player (1988/1990) (upgraded with parts from a PD-3000, the JPN market version)
PIONEER PD-M90X Reference Multi-Play CD Player (1987/1989) (the very first REFERENCE/ELITE multi-play CDP)
PIONEER CT-S800 (1988/1990) full-featured TOTL Single-Well LaserAmorphous-Head cassette deck, with casted-iron transformer
PIONEER DV-09 Reference DVD Player (1998/2000)
PIONEER CLD-3030 TOTL Compatible Laser Disc Player (1988/1989)
PIONEER GR-777 Ten Band Stereo Graphic Equalizer (1988/199?) (TOTL remote controllable EQ with dual spectrum display)
PIONEER CS-G503 Four-Way Stereo Loudspeaker System (199?)
PIONEER SE-305 Stereo Headphones (1974)
PIONEER MR-100 Multi-Room IR Receiver (1989/199?)
PIONEER CU-MR100 Remote Control Unit (1989/199?)
PIONEER CU-AV70 Programmable Remote Control Unit (1988/1989)
PIONEER CU-AV100 Programmable Remote Control Unit (1988/1989)
PIONEER CU-AV200 Programmable Remote Control Unit (1989/1993)

-MISC.-

ELAC MIRACORD 46 Direct Drive Phonograph Turntable (197?)
PIONEER PD-M6 Multi-CD player (1985/1986) (the very first PIONEER magazine CD changer)
JVC HR-S8000U S-VHS VCR (1988/1990)
ROLAND BOSS BR-1180 Hard Disk Digital Audio Recorder (2002)
JVC RM-S1 Universal Programmable Touch-Panel Remote Control (1988/1???)

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Pure_Brew
Posted: August 28, 2010 09:09 pm
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QUOTE (dingus @ August 25, 2010 11:11 am)
i've done more than my fair share of chasing my tail, but in the end i've found more value in enjoying the gear i have than lusting after what i dont. we dont have the technology yet where sound can be reproduced with true fidelity, so the endless pursuit for better gear ultimately leads to disappointment. better to put more focus on the music imo.

I'm definitely moving in this direction. I've been buying more music lately and enjoying it more then ever before. Of course, I do enjoy the benefits of a decent playback system.


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System: Snell JIV & CIV. PS Audio 200c. Denon DAP-2500. Parasound CDP/1000. Parasound DAC/1000. Nikko Gamma 20

Back-Up: Pioneer SX-1280
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stuwee
Posted: August 30, 2010 12:09 am
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*Ahem*


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Main: Yamaha MX-800U, Marantz 2270 as a preamp, Thorens TD125MKII SME3009II Shure V15 IV, Teac V-8000S, Denon DN-790R, Fostex E-2, Panasonic DVD/CD, Martin Logan The Sequel, JBL L56 for a change
#2: Kenwood Basic M1D, Yamaha CX-600U, Luxman K-112, AR-4x
#3: Marantz 2270, Kenwood KX-1060, Pioneer PL-1000A,Teac X-3, DCM KX12 II
#4: SAE A202, SAE P102, varies
#5: Sanyo A35 Plus Series, Nakamichi BX-300, AKG K601 cans
Favorite: Pilot 1090 console
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MacGyver
Posted: September 04, 2010 08:31 am
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QUOTE (stuwee @ August 29, 2010 11:09 pm)
*Ahem*



"Ahem" what? soundt/confused-smiley-013.gif


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user posted image

PIONEER VSX-D1S TOTL 130w/ch. A/V Stereo Receiver (1990/1993)
PIONEER PD-91 Reference Compact Disc Player (1988/1990) (upgraded with parts from a PD-3000, the JPN market version)
PIONEER PD-M90X Reference Multi-Play CD Player (1987/1989) (the very first REFERENCE/ELITE multi-play CDP)
PIONEER CT-S800 (1988/1990) full-featured TOTL Single-Well LaserAmorphous-Head cassette deck, with casted-iron transformer
PIONEER DV-09 Reference DVD Player (1998/2000)
PIONEER CLD-3030 TOTL Compatible Laser Disc Player (1988/1989)
PIONEER GR-777 Ten Band Stereo Graphic Equalizer (1988/199?) (TOTL remote controllable EQ with dual spectrum display)
PIONEER CS-G503 Four-Way Stereo Loudspeaker System (199?)
PIONEER SE-305 Stereo Headphones (1974)
PIONEER MR-100 Multi-Room IR Receiver (1989/199?)
PIONEER CU-MR100 Remote Control Unit (1989/199?)
PIONEER CU-AV70 Programmable Remote Control Unit (1988/1989)
PIONEER CU-AV100 Programmable Remote Control Unit (1988/1989)
PIONEER CU-AV200 Programmable Remote Control Unit (1989/1993)

-MISC.-

ELAC MIRACORD 46 Direct Drive Phonograph Turntable (197?)
PIONEER PD-M6 Multi-CD player (1985/1986) (the very first PIONEER magazine CD changer)
JVC HR-S8000U S-VHS VCR (1988/1990)
ROLAND BOSS BR-1180 Hard Disk Digital Audio Recorder (2002)
JVC RM-S1 Universal Programmable Touch-Panel Remote Control (1988/1???)

user posted image

♥Aoi Nishimata Fan♥
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